Navigating Life After a Power Plant Experience, Intention and Integration. EP027

Paul Hutchinson [00:00:10]

Welcome to another episode of Liberating Humanity. I am Paul Hutchinson. So excited to spend some time today talking about one of my new favorite subjects. So much so that I worked hard with a team of guys to try to change some of the laws here in Utah. What I’m talking about is something that we’ve been taught our entire life is super dangerous like as dangerous as cocaine but safer than table sugar. We’re going to talk about that today with my good friend Mike.

Ads Paul Hutchinson  [00:00:38]

Hey guys. I’m interrupting this podcast to talk to you really quickly about an amazing book coming out “The sound of Freedom”. The first of the Child Liberation series. It goes into the details of the Child Rescue Mission. Some of these that you’ve heard on these podcasts and other information that you haven’t heard. Excited to share this with you. Click on the link below to get your copy of The Sound of Freedom.

Paul Hutchinson [00:01:04]

Mike has done a lot of work. He’s helped us with facilitating a lot of our experiences in South America. We have some healing Retreats down there. Now you may ask, how does that have anything to do with child trafficking and everything else? Again, like I said in the last episode, fixing the problem with child trafficking starts with fixing the demand. I couldn’t ever imagine how somebody would get to the point where they thought that it was okay to go rape an 11-year-old or a 12-year-old. How does that happen? How does somebody get to the point where they are so depraved in their personal life that they think that creating that kind of harm on another person is okay. Anyways, years ago I was introduced to some tools to help people overcome their childhood trauma in ways that were phenomenal and what I couldn’t believe is that I had never heard of these my entire life. I thought that they were super dangerous and they’re not so today we’re going to talk in detail about psychedelics. What the good, the bad, the ugly I’m going to talk about the facilitators that are doing it wrong. I’m going to be super opinionated about this because if we don’t get this right we’re destroying the ability to really help Humanity heal but if we do it right there’s some powerful tools. So Mike, thank you for joining us today. One of the reasons I brought Mike is because he knows me really well and he’s gonna kind of operate by interviewing me on my own podcast right but he’s gonna throw in a lot of stuff back and forth but he knows this space. He knows how I work in this space and is super excited to be here together with you again today Mike. Thank you for joining us. 

Mike [00:02:54]

It’s always a pleasure to have a conversation and I think what we’re going to get into is a lot of sacred stuff but also changing the lens of how we view it and we’re going to have some fun with it because I think it provides such a beautiful spot for healing and opportunity to exist in this world and change some of the problems and lenses that people have been thinking about this for a long time. 

Paul Hutchinson [00:03:12]

Absolutely. So tell me this, when did you first get introduced to what I call power plants or plant medicine?

Mike [00:03:20]

To preface this, I was investing and we were looking at a whole bunch of different companies and ketamine crossed my desk and it was one of those things that was like, what is this? What are psychedelics? Why? What’s so important about changing the lens that we look at? And then shortly thereafter and this was two years ago. It was ketamine is the more of the synthetic psychedelic and then you have plant medicine which goes into many various different routes whether it’s psilocybin or iowaska or some of these other more beautiful plants that exist and it caught my eye of like, why aren’t we talking about this? Why does this exist? And so psilocybin was the first plant medicine that I got into to really start understanding how beautiful that Mother Nature has created to be able to change our mind and our realities and be able to do amazing things with it. So about two years ago, I got introduced to it. It’s been a beautiful Journey ever since.

Paul Hutchinson [00:04:14]

You use the word “change your mind”. There’s actually a book called “change your mind” that talks a lot about the process of using these tools and how they’ve been used throughout all of history. In fact there’s another one that I really like that is called “the immortality key” and the immortality key. Have you read the immortality key? 

Mike [00:04:33]

Briefly I have it in my audio books and I need to finish it but I know where you’re going with this so.

Paul Hutchinson [00:04:41]

Well, what’s super cool in that book he goes through and studies how different types of psychedelics were actually used in the early Christian Church sacraments not that people could have some crazy experience but because of its ability to what I call in the veil. Okay again we live in this world where we’re so bombarded with things in our five senses. The things that we can see, The things that we can hear, The things that we can feel, The things that we can taste. Those are just bombarding us all the time and we lose connection to the spiritual world around us. We lose connection to our divine self, our higher Consciousness, we lose that connection because we’re so bombarded with other things that figuring out how to thin that veil of forgetfulness. Again we’re born in this world not remembering, not remembering our life before this one, not remembering our connection with God, not remembering our divine connection with each other but if we can find ways to thin that Veil. We can start sensing that beautiful Divine connection that we all have to each other, We can start really tuning into our mission, our divine calling, our connection with God all of these, our connection with everything around us with Mother Nature. Those are all things that plant medicine does in helping us to truly connect and so some of those books will help you see. In fact that’s the first place that I read about some of the studies that were done by John Hawkins University and one of those studies said that 76% of people who go through a guided meditation plant medicine experience. 76% of them said it was the number one most transformational 24 hours of their life which is phenomenal and 100% of them said it was within the top five most transformational experiences of their life. That really caught my attention. I said okay, if I’ve had some transformational experiences but to say that that 76% of people say that this one tool created that kind of a transformation that deserves taking a deeper look.

Mike [00:06:57]

Well I think to take a step further than that if you look at like most of in mainstream we being pointed back to ancient Egypt right now and if we look back at what they use the blue lotus flower for in their Sacrament in the rituals to be able to thin the veil as a way of life to be able to go and interact and access higher levels of consciousness to be able to bring that back into society as a way of love and compassion and I think we’ve lost some of that and I think you know. This is a perfect point to ask the question like, where in western civilization? Do we start frowning upon these medicines? And what was The Narrative and the story? I mean you’ve been so instrumental in trying to bring that mainstream especially here in Utah but when did that shift in the western society that we’ve all of a sudden be like this is so scary and when did the “War on Drugs” take form because I think that paints a beautiful picture of like why are we even having to have this conversation?

Paul Hutchinson [00:07:56]

Well you probably did some additional research on this as well but from my understanding in the late 60s you know, we had Woodstock. We had the you know people painting their VW buses with little flowers and whatever else and go into these parties and the issue is that there was this elevated consciousness of a lot of people not wanting to go to war. They didn’t want to go fight in the Vietnam War. They didn’t want to be out there fighting. They wanted Love, Not War. This was kind of the energy and President Nixon is like, oh we’ve got a little bit of a problem here, we can’t control the minds and the direction of our people if they are connecting with their higher Consciousness, if they are in this space where they would rather you know Make Love Not War type of a thing and have this connected energy they didn’t want to go kill the Asians, they didn’t want to kill that, they didn’t want to do any of that stuff. They wanted connectedness with all of humanity and that’s where it was going and so the decision was made to classify psychedelics as schedule one drugs. Now what that means, they’re in the same categorization as cocaine of heroin of all of these really heavy destructive drugs because they’re scheduled one and what’s crazy is for the last 50 years literally if I was caught with a bag of magic mushrooms I could go to prison for that because it’s a schedule one drug right. I go to prison on schedule for magic mushrooms and so we’ve thought our whole life. I’ve thought wow, those things they’re as dangerous as cocaine. Well they’re not, psilocybin is safer than table sugar because if you really look into it table sugar is not very safe right, okay so psilocybin there’s never been a case of Overdose. There’s never been a case of addiction and when used properly and properly is the key. We’re going to talk a lot about that properly here but when used properly Can it can open up a Gateway of Enlightenment of healing of shedding trauma and ego and arrogance and all of these things that are creating so many problems in today’s world like my wife jokes and she says what we need to do instead offsets of putting fluoride in the water we should put psilocybin in the water right so that way instead of calcifying the pineal gland which we’ll talk about later as well we will actually open up those neuro Pathways and those connections with each other and create a better world. 

Mike [00:10:31]

I mean, I think you hit on such a good point in the 60s when we don’t fully understand something or when we want to control the outcome of certain things it’s very easy to just Exile or stop any movement and if we look back at the origins of the plant medicine movement or LSD it was because people started having more connectedness with themselves and there’s a lot of studies and research even that has done about how to actually navigate, how we think, how we show up in this world and if you can control how people operate when we have these beautiful tools that allow us to become more connected with ourselves. What happens then and we stop having these conversations or we view it as bad and then there’s stigma around it and then we don’t want to venture off and try these new beautiful things because they’re scary or we don’t want to step into them but in all reality I mean, what we’ll get into is just the absolute beauty Beauty and purity of what can happen when we have access to these things.

Paul Hutchinson [00:11:30]

I think you said a key word there was control as well see here, here’s the scary underbelly of this whole thing, for millions of years even before this Earth was it’s a battle of control versus freedom, of slavery versus you know expansion you know that’s really what everything is about is that level of control and for me you know in fighting child trafficking it’s all about the understanding that today we live in a world that has more slaves than ever before in history but it’s not just the slaves and human trafficking. I believe that if we really take a step back and we understand how a lot of the powers that be are implementing this Mass psychosis and creating this level of control over Humanity, they don’t want us to connect with in ourselves, they don’t want us to connect with each other, they don’t want us to connect with our higher Consciousness and with God they don’t and there’s thousands of examples of things that they’ve done with our food, the things that they’ve done in our water, things that they’ve done in demonizing some of these beautiful tools that are all tied to an agenda of slavery, an agenda of control and so we’ve all seen it the people there. There’s a funny meme that I saw once that said, most of our political leaders have never tried psychedelics, those of us who have tried it know why that’s a problem.

Mike [00:13:14]

And it’s so true, like when you start connecting with your heart space you start changing your mind and realize how much abundance is in this world and why do we need all the controls and regulations that are in place when in all reality let people choose for themselves. So I think maybe that’s a perfect segue into maybe we could get into the beauty of what psychedelic are as we kind of just talked about this stigma of why it’s been controlled for so long. So maybe why don’t you talk about like what is so beautiful about psychedelics and why it’s so important that it gives us this opportunity to change our mindset and kind of change the way and how we view this opportunity that we have?

Paul Hutchinson [00:13:49]

For me, I’ll just tell you my own personal experiences because you know I can tell details and laws and Science and whatever else. I’ll just tell you my personal experience because this was everything to me. I was invited about eight years ago into a guided meditation plant medicine Journey experience using psychedelics and number one the facilitator was a doctor, she was highly trained, she had studied all over the world in different types of holistic healing and was was very trained in understanding what tools needed to be used to break down Egos and to help people release trauma Etc and I came into that space not thinking I needed to be fixed. That was the problem, right. I thought I was Paul Hutchinson and I can you know, I don’t need to fix anything. I have no trauma whatsoever. No, I was creating trauma by me right and I had self-imposed trauma because of that ego Etc and in that space I was able to break down those ego walls, the things that I had build up to artificially create what I thought was success and happiness and I was able to feel like I had never felt before, I was able to feel a deep deep love for myself for my kids for Humanity in ways that I had kind of shielded it because I didn’t really love Paul. I was trying to artificially show who I was and what I had achieved but I didn’t really love me and it came from some different traumas throughout my life and some challenges that I had in relationships Etc but once I started to really feel. Once I really started to feel that inner love, that true Godlike love for myself, then and only then could I start to feel that love for others. In fact I remember my cousin Dave, a beautiful soul and he had spent a lot of his life in a state of self-loathing had a very very difficult childhood with a dad who was super abusive and very very very unloving in anything in his childhood and Dave was acting out in so many ways that were unhealthy in his adult life and I remember that very first experience he sat on a bean bag for about six hours straight learning to love Dave just learning to respect the good that he was and that started a transition in his life that now finally after 20 years of trying in all kinds of relationships finally he’s in a super healthy relationship and very authentic in everything that he is and it’s because it helped change those neuro Pathways. They’ve actually done studies where they’ve taken brain cells and they’ve put some psilocybin in there and it starts growing dendrites you know. We have a problem when people are addicted, you’re addicted to pornography, you’re addicted to cocaine, these hardcore addictions and stuff you’ve got this direct dopamine hit. This super highway that goes from directly here and it’s super hard to break away from that Direct Hit. Well if you can regrow some of those dendrites you can start recreating what is healthy and getting away from some of those addictions. So you’ve studied a bunch of the effects of psychedelics, what have you found in your personal experiences as well?

Mike [00:18:08]

Well I think if we truly understand what psychedelics kind of, what you’re talking about is if we imagine a ski slope and the runs going down a ski scope we start putting grooves into our behaviors and our patterns and if we can take an opportunity like psychedelics which psychedelics affect our spiritual and our emotional aspects of who we are in our existence and if we have this opportunity to take an experience have these heightened emotions and A New Perspective we can kind of smooth out those grooves in the ski slope which gives us new opportunities to kind of change the way we navigate in life and it’s one of the most beautiful things because in a short eight hour period you can almost have this same amount of Reflections in 5 to 10 years of talk therapy and so as we’ve kind of been talking like there’s so many tools out there but psychedelics in its own component can be an Accel. One of the most accelerated forms of healing that’s ever existed and I think the beautiful aspect of this that we have to ask questions of is, it’s a plant medicine Mother Earth gave us this opportunity, how do we then utilize it, how do we view it, how do we then become familiar with it. So we can be able to utilize it ourselves but actually show up and facilitate for others to be able to change the perspective and how we do it and for me what I always like to say, the medicine will find us when the time is right and for me I was going through a very hard point in my life, I was a Founder, serial entrepreneur had a lot of anxiety and I was doing a lot of Aderall, a lot of caffeine my marriage was in not the best place and it allowed me a place where I could come in have this experience and be able to reflect on what am I doing wrong and how am I showing up in this world in a way that I wasn’t proud of and allowed me to take steps and actions to be able to clean things up in my environment that I could then start showing up and being a better person in society and I had done talk therapy, I had done just about everything and psychedelics gave me the opportunity in a very short amount of time to really reflect on myself and really make the decisions that I needed to really change and take full sovereignty over how I was showing up in this reality. 

Paul Hutchinson [00:20:19]

One of the most powerful things that did for me was showing me empathy like, I had never ever experienced before you know. When I talk about learning how to just really feel that love for myself and then feeling that love for others in that process of that connection that connection with other people from that heart space you can’t connect with somebody else from a True Heart space without feeling how your actions have affected them and so it was one of the most beautiful horrible experiences of my life in feeling with every cell of my body. I could feel the pain of other people that I had affected in my life, like employees that I was unkind to you know, or relationships that I wasn’t loyal to or you know harsh words or actions that I had done throughout my life. I could feel true empathy like I had never ever felt before and in the process of feeling that empathy because of that connection, that spiritual connection with that person it was able to help me adjust my ego and how my actions really take. A self assessment that I never could before and that was powerful for me. It was a big transition you pointed out as well. I can’t tell you how many years of therapy that I went to that you know I was in a dysfunctional relationship. I go into the therapist trying to fix whatever I need to fix and I found myself trying to impress that therapist right and literally a 24 to 48 hour period of time with one or two back to back Journey experiences using plant medicine I got more out of that than 10 and 20 years of therapy. The very first time I told my parents that  you laugh because you know, we both grew up in a very Orthodox world. We both grew up LDS and so the first time I told my mom I said, you know I feel closer to God since I started doing some of these guided meditation plant medicine experiences. I feel closer to God than I’ve ever felt in my entire life and she said, you only feel close to God when you’re doing drugs right. Now since that time she’s you know opened up and understood kind of what it means to me and what it means in the transitions that we’ve had but the reality is it’s not something you have to keep on taking. Literally some people have one single experience and it elevates their Consciousness and their connection with their Divine self and with God for life. It’s a permanent change in your psyche which is super beautiful. 

Mike [00:23:21]

When I think to that point which Segways into like a much broader conversation but plant medicine really gives hope like at the end of the day when you go through these short experiences it gives you hope that there is other alternatives to how we can show up in this reality whether we’re coming from a place of suicidal or being a place of hopelessness or not being able to change our reality and  if you look at Society right now, I think it’s relevant to talk about and there’s some great organizations that are working on various aspects. We have Maps organization that is working to get MDMA therapy legalized in August is kind of the verdict but there’s people whether it’s PTSD from war, we have veterans that are taking their lives all the time, we have people with anxiety, we have people with addictions like there’s a very broad spectrum that these types of solutions can give hope to and I also don’t want to say that it’s a cure all fix all because taking this experience, this beautiful experience still comes with work afterwards and so there’s pieces to this but I think if we were to look at just how many people on the spectrum of creating a better life for themselves it can give so much opportunity and we have to ask the questions of like why is this so important and how do we get access to it to be able to give more people hope because that at the end of the day is the most important thing we can offer anybody in this existence.

Paul Hutchinson [00:24:52]

Touched on the veterans there’s like, what is it 22 veterans a day are committing suicide right. Now that’s a horrific number and so many of them come and are just labeled with this stamp for the rest of their life with PTSD. So you’re disabled the rest of your life because you fought in these wars and now you have PTSD and their image of themselves and they’re carrying this burden their entire life with this label of PTI. I’ve got post-traumatic stress disorder. Well that is curable guys, it’s curable. I worked for a decade in my early 20s into my 30s in helping people overcome anxiety and depression disorders and we had a program where it took 12 weeks of one to two hours a day with a guided coach as part of this process, to help people change the negative habit patterns of thought that were creating anxiety. In the first place, well today we’re able to make those same changes not in 12 weeks, in 24 to 48 hours and we’ve done it a bunch. We host these in Latin America all the time you know guys, you can go to liberating-humanity.com you can get the links right there to come and join us on some of our healing Retreats and if this calls to you in some way I would encourage you to find trained facilitators that are doing it right and I want to talk about that for a bunch of this session of what that looks like guys who are doing it wrong and guys doing it right so you touched on a little bit of of the the integration part. So in your opinion, what is the right way of using this medicine and the wrong way? What does that look like? 

Mike [00:26:39]

Well I think going into whatever this is, what intention do you have? What do you want to get out of the experience? And then are you willing to do the work after because I think as we are in these plant medicine experiences with train facilitators, they can help guide us through and we’ll have these insights, we’ll have these ideas, come we’ll see a better version of our life that we can have but then it’s how do we take those insights and integrate it into everything that we’re doing in our day-to-day lives because if we don’t integrate we’ll want to keep coming back to these magical experiences with these mushrooms or psychedelics because that sometimes can be the only relief that we get from this current existence and if we don’t take the time to integrate and fully understand what it is that and how we’re operating, we’re going to keep going back to that same place and I think you saw that and some of the coaching your early company where if you don’t address some of those early foundational pieces of our psyche, we’ll keep experiencing the same things over and over again and then it doesn’t matter if we’re using mushrooms or these other psychedelics to be able to change our reality, if we don’t want to fully integrate and respect the experience that we had.

Paul Hutchinson [00:27:48]

Well you see people a lot and I’m going to tell you how not to do this right. Number one, medicine is not going to fix your life. Okay it’s going to, it’s going to create a new pathway for you to follow right. I like to think of it as. My cousin just yesterday said, it’s kind of like if you take a bunch of dynamite and you’re blowing a big hole in the Rocks so that you can you know build something there but if you just blow it up then you have a bunch of rocks all over and if you don’t go in and excavate it out if instead you just keep blowing up rocks and you’re never going be able to get in there right. You have to do the excavation part and I also think of it as if you think of a maze right. You’ve got the start and the Finish Line on this Maze and so you’re trying to figure out in your daily life, you’re trying to figure out how to get to, this finish Line could be self-love. It could be, you know, not being so quick to anger my kids. It could be more present in my relationship with my spouse, it could be overcoming addictions to pornography or other drugs or whatnot, it could be there’s a hundred different things that we’re fighting our subconscious mind all the time. Fighting how do I get to that Finish Line, how do I get there, what happens, I’m going to call Journey space. This plant medicine experience is that path in that maze lights up, so you know exactly how to get to that place of peace, that place of self-love, that place of patience whatever it is you know. How to get there you know, how it feels to be in that place of compassion, whatever it is you’re trying to get to you know exactly what it feels like exactly how to get there and then the next day, the next week, the next month you find yourself in the situation where you’re dealing with the same anxiety issues and you’re like, no I know, I know what it feels like to get to that place of peace or that place of confidence whatever it is you know. What it feels like you know the path to get there and now you have to walk it. Now it’s a matter of taking those steps and doing the integration side and so many people they’ll go into a plant medicine experience and they’ll number one not have a clear intention, they’ll just get there, okay fix my [ __ ] for me. No you have to have a clear intention of where you want to be, what that 4.0 version of you. I say 4.0 because we’ve all been working on ourselves, we’re all at a 2.0 version hopefully right but that 4.0 version, what does that next step of you look like. Not just I want to be really rich, no how do you want to show up for your kids? How do you want to show up for your spouse? How do you want to show up for your employees? What kind of a man? What kind of a woman do you really want to be from a heart space? And what does that look like? That’s the 4.0 version of you and once you’ve identified that and you go in with that clear intention the medicine will help you identify clearly what that road looks like but then you have to take the road and walk it and that’s what integration is all about.

Mike [00:31:00]

And there’s various components to that whether it’s daily intention, daily practice, all referencing back to that experience that you had that the medicine was able to facilitate to integrate. I mean we just, what was it three weeks ago? We took 20 people through this transformative experience and the testimonials and you I’m sure you’ll share some in a second but these people were working on lifetimes of trauma everything from whether it was judgment that they had and how they showed up in their workplace to sexual trauma both guys and girls and I think that’s an awareness and it’s okay to talk about because guys are just as much affected of things in their childhood and some of these memories are so suppressed that we don’t even know that they’re there and so the space that was able to be created in this journey and the data that you could you call it data of these 20 people whether it’s mourning the loss of a child, whether it’s earlier friends that were lost and be able to hold space and compassion to be able to show up and do the integration because a lot of the times we don’t know how to face the pain that really comes with a lot of these experiences of Being Human and the plant medicine and then the facilit facilitators and also the ceremony space that I think we can talk about why it’s so important to cultivate can hold a container for us to reflect on that with love and compassion to be able to actually do the next steps of integration afterwards to continue to show up and take those learning experiences because the people that were in that Journey, they’re still integrating every single day and they’re getting constant Reflections from their family, from their friends of a different person like, so there is hope and our friends can see it very quickly because of that hope that’s instilled throughout that experience and be able to see that 4.0 version come into reality very quickly.

Paul Hutchinson [00:32:57]

You know you touched on the event. A few weeks ago we started out in facilitating these experiences specifically for people who had childhood sexual trauma because that’s kind of the world I came from a lot of times, when I would speak people would come up afterwards they say, oh you know what, I was raped by my uncle and these kind of things happen and whatever and we realize there’s a huge percentage of people who are carrying that trauma and so in the beginning we were focusing specifically on people who had that childhood sexual trauma. More recently we’ve moved into what I call the tip of the umbrella you know, the leaders, the people who if I can help them transform their lives from a heart space then at that point they can reach out and literally transform the lives of hundreds, if not thousands of people and so that’s what we did at this event. These were real estate fund managers like what I was in my journey and financial journey and very successful real Estate guys that we brought them all in together into this container, this space in a beautiful beautiful location in South America where they all came in together, there was a 4-day event. The first day is all setting intentions getting really specific about where you want to be and what that better version of you looks like and then the second and third nights were both using the medicine and really helping people through some of the trauma and then the last day is all integration and then beyond that continued integration and so the issues that I see in this space for this number one, people thinking oh you know what, I can just go take some mushrooms, go to a rave party and you know have a good trip or a bad trip whatever happens there. Now years like three or four or five years ago I was like you know what, I’m not going to judge anybody who’s using this recreationally but this is different here. Now I am going to judge them okay here’s why there is so much value in having the right facilitators, the right space, the right intention, the right followup and if you’re going to a rave party and you’re taking a bunch of magic mushrooms there, first of all, the energy is wrong right. You’ve got going on over here and you know, rap music going on over here and you’ve got you know, all this just energy that is not really healthy energy, not aligned with that better version of you type energy and if you’re thinning that veil in a space that has that negative energy of course you’re going to have a bad trip right  okay but if you if you’re setting the Sacred Space similar to what I do in my meditations that we talked about in another podcast is setting that Sacred Space and really helping people focus on that very best version of themselves than the medicine is able to help to form that, it’s kind of like having some play doh in your hand and help you form that subconscious mind in the way that you want to help you really delve in the best version of you.

Mike [00:36:12]

And I want to take a second because I think in these experiences like we’re talking about them as they’re so easy to kind of step into when somebody that is being called to the medicine or doing some of this higher level work, there’s a lot of anxiety that can come from it once you make the commitment. It’s like what am I doing is this really happening and I think that’s something so beautiful that you’ve worked so hard to do is create a container but also the type of stewardship that these facilitators are embodying to make it safe and so I think it’s important to touch on. I would love to hear why it’s so important how you’ve set this up to be able to allow people to come into this type of space with an open heart with curiosity, with safety so they can do that work because I’d be lying if I said it was easy. Every time we host a journey there’s a few people that just get right up to that doorstep and they’re like, I don’t want to do it. So I think let’s spend some time like, why have you been working so hard to curate what you have now and all the experiences that have led up to make it such a successful experience. 

Paul Hutchinson [00:37:16]

I found years ago with an attacking anxiety program that we had. The very thing that we were fighting stopped a lot of people from overcoming it. The anxiety, the negative selft talk, the worry, the What if thinking, the negative expectations those are all things that are tied into those anxiety and that fear that they have. Well if you’re having negative expectations and worry and what if thinking and you’re going into this experience that could be life-changing. We had multiple people on. This last one, that very last day said, hey you know what, one of the guys said, I’m at the airport ready to fly and I cannot get on the plane my anxiety won’t allow me and I told him I said, brother, you know that’s why you need to be here right. That’s exactly why you wanted to be here is to overcome those limitations that have affected every area of your life and now it’s stopping you from being here. Now fortunately there were a lot of other people who had that same anxiety that’s why they’re going. You have to shed those fears, those things that are holding you back from being the best version of yourself that you can be and creating a safe environment for them was so important. Safe from a physical standpoint but most importantly safe from a compassionate standpoint and having them get to know each one of the facilitators and how they’re leading from a place of the heart and the facilitators literally spend days setting up our experiences, not only in finding the perfect space and making sure that transportation is all very easy but most importantly in getting themselves into an energetic space of healing and compassion and being able to create a very safe environment for people to let go of their crap. Now to help people understand too, if you have some anxiety about oh no I don’t want to remember the things of my childhood that I blocked on purpose right. Well it’s not that way, you’re not going to all of a sudden be in your seven-year-old body and feeling that horrible whatever else, you’re going to see it from a from a different perspective, you’re going to change how you’re viewing it, you’re going to see that seven-year-old you from a place of compassion and now you and your adult self can go back and give that seven-year-old what he or she really needed at the time you know. We think in this linear plane thinking okay this happened there I can’t change it this is the future whatever else guess what, you can’t change it. We don’t live in a linear plane. We live in this revolving Eternal energy in universe and you can literally go back in time and emotionally you take your adult self in the medicine space, sitting together with that seven-year-old you who was abused by her uncle who was left by her mother whatever. It is and say okay now what does that seven-year-old need, what does she need to hear right now, does she need a hug can you give that to her, can you give her the love and the support that she needs and literally help heal that seven-year-old self in your adult body and it’s beautiful but the facilitators can help in that process and for me I remember, one of my experiences I had thought I had done a few of these and I fixed most of my stuff cuz I had a lot of stuff to fix and I was good and I was now a facilitator. I was trained as a facilitator, I was helping but we had brought some ladies in who had dealt with some really heavy stuff. One was sold by her own mother to the community as a child for sex, one was raped by her uncle and her bishop and her I mean a whole bunch of just crazy heavy negative energy and so we brought in one of my mentors and a guy by the name of Jonathan to help in the facilitating and it was about 10:00 at night we had helped, been working with everybody else and then Jonathan said to me he said, Paul so are you ready to work on some of your stuff? I said I already did that. I did that five years ago. I’m good right. I’m good. He goes, let’s go deeper, you get to go deeper deeper he said, do you trust me and that was the key you have to totally trust the facilitators you’re with and I said, yeah I do trust you. He goes let me take you there and he gave me a Heroes dose as we call it boom. It took me to a place where I was laying there on the bed. I was holding my wife’s hand and he took me back to my seven-year-old self who was being beat up in school and my 14-year-old self that had some challenges and all of these different things and he helped me. Really unpack some stuff that I didn’t know were still rotting inside of me. Really heavy energy that I needed to release but it was the love and compassion of a trained facilitator that made all the difference in that space.

Mike [00:42:30]

And I think what you’re reflecting on too. Is like we are our own healers and sometimes when we have the reflection of somebody that has so much love and compassion for us it allows us to go deeper in ourselves because when else do we get that environment when we truly have undivided attention or love that we can really channel into ourselves to be able to have that full experience and I think compared to all the journeys or the facilitators and experiences what you’ve cultivated and really put emphasis on is how does that show up so that people can be safe in their own environment because there’s a lot of different traumas that are happening and these are people like you said earlier, these are very influential people and sometimes it’s really hard to express or be vulnerable to what those things are but you have to realize that we are imperfect and we’ve had our own struggles and our challenges. That’s how we can empathize and that’s how we can show up and be able to have that love and compassion because everybody’s story is unique but the trauma And the emotions that we’re talking about are Universal and I think that’s where it really goes back to where you have set so much time effort and experience over the years whether you want to share that now of like why it has led to these current experiences whether it’s the music the people that are there, how they’re holding space the talents that some of these people have to be able to work on some of the deepest levels of trauma that exist,

Paul Hutchinson [00:44:06]

Well and I think that for me, the reason I like working with entrepreneurs and business owners with big egos, you know, is my cousin Dave said so eloquently last night he said, we’re all recovering [ __ ] right. That’s really why I’m able to come into that space with others recovering [ _ ] right. We can all hold space for it other and say okay, this is who we used to be and this is who we are now and this is who we want to be and what does that path look like of healing because there’s not one of us that hasn’t offended. Somebody in our life and been an a-hole at some point in life all of these things there. We’re all recovering from being out of Integrity in some space and if we can work through our own issues then we can be an example and help others and you’re exactly  right. We’re our own healers. The medicine isn’t going to heal people and your facilitator isn’t going to heal you but both of them are going to create a safe space to allow you to work through what you need to work through and heal yourself. One of thehealing experiences that we facilitated, we had a couple that was working for us in one of our companies and the gal had just some heavy heavy energy that was affecting her at work and her home life and everything else and we sat for more than two hours with her husband, myself and my wife, Vanessa all helping her finally get to the point where she could look in the mirror and say, I love you and even then she couldn’t do it with confidence. She wouldn’t even look in the mirror at first and finally over time she was able to get to the point where she could look in the mirror and say, I like you and then she would turn down and finally got to,  it was painstakingly heavy difficult for us to get to that point but she had to do the work and unfortunately, she was putting up so many blocks, she kind of wanted to be stuck and you you said it yourself how the medicine doesn’t fix you and sometimes you have to be called to the medicine and in that situation I think we were trying to push it on her helping, we wanted her to heal more than she wanted to heal and it was like picking up this dead log you know. All this weight that I didn’t want to stand up again and so if people say it’s plant medicine, for me well if you don’t want to change then no. It’s not for you, if you want to change, if you want to be the best version of you, if you want to heal then absolutely it’s a powerful tool that can change your life. 

Mike [00:47:00]

So and to that point like the love, that compassion that’s created in these ceremonies you could find them all over the world and they’ve been even experienced them all over the world and they have this different energy whether it’s the people that are coming in and kind of the intention behind it and there’s Beauty but there’s also contrast. I’ll use contrast as a word because I think it’s super relevant to talk about the types of the intentions or the types of Ceremonies that are happening because sometimes we lose sight of what the purity of this is. I think it’s beneficial to maybe talk about for a second of what have you seen in other Realms that have maybe been abusing some of these beautiful energies and why kind of how you’re creating this template that’s going to be replicated all over to be able to show up but I think it’s worth I don’t want to say bad because it all has its own experience but I think it’s worth mentioning just to give people an idea so they can question what type of Ceremonies they’re going into because it is so transformative.

Paul Hutchins [00:47:59]

Yeah so two or three things. Thank you for asking. Number one, you have to know the purity of the medicine itself. There are a lot of guys out there who are playing in this space that you know. Hey we’re getting this stuff in from California and whatever else and you do testing on it and it’s got some chemicals in there that are not entirely healthy right. So what we use is pure plant-based. We know the shamans that are growing. The mushrooms that we work only with the Pure Plant medicine and without any extra chemicals and stuff. So that’s number one, is knowing the source of where it’s coming from. Number two, is the facilitators themselves cannot have ulterior motives. We’ve actually seen facilitators that will throw in stuff like MDMA just so that they can put people into a state where they’re more susceptible and maybe you know, date them later to build a you know sexual relationship. There we have some hard rules of zero Sexual Energy at all in this space. I don’t even care if somebody comes as a married couple together, no Sexual Energy at all. That is off limits in this space. You’re going to feel this open heart energy and this connection with everybody but those that is, there’s no room for that in our space, no Sexual Energy at all. If you feel a connection where you need a hug from somebody you actually ask them. I don’t care if it’s your own spouse ask them, are you okay if I hug you right now? You know just in that space because it’s so important to treat it with honor and respect in this healing process because you can be somewhat vulnerable when you remember everything, you’re not going to be in a place where you can get raped or whatever else you know. Everything that’s going on and you remember everything that’s going on but and you’re in control of everything that you’re doing and creating but the taking down some of those walls can make you susceptible to different types of energies and so making sure that we have the right environment, the right container, the right people that are there, that are coming from a place of the heart and are coming from a place of true Integrity as part of the healing is super important,

Mike [00:50:10]

And is there like a certain number of people that you like to have in these ceremonies so that you can give the best experience to these people because I’ve heard some people like to have whole houses of these and to me that seems like it might get out of hand.

Paul Hutchinson [00:50:25]

Well, part of it, I like to look at the facilitator versus the participant ratio. We like to have at least one facilitator for every four people minimum. So if I’ve got 20 people there, I want to have five facilitators that are there. I think that’s important and we’ve realized that more than 20 people is is difficult for us to really work through and have them all have the experience they need, less than 10 people I like having the energy of 10 or more people there. I think it adds to the experience of coming through with other people that have similar backgrounds and interests as yourself. So we in this case, we had all real estate professionals that all came together, we’ve had other ones where we’ve had you know, stay-at-home moms that all came together and whatnot so having that container of supporting individuals because sometimes it’s not just a facilitator, sometimes it’s an interaction with one of the other participants that gives you some aha moments and you really feel this beautiful connection with other couple or whatever else where you can really talk through your issues together. So now we’ve had some that are smaller, my wife and I had Journey experiences where it was just the two of us and the facilitator and that was super powerful because nothing else was going on and that was important for us because when there’s a group of people were healers ourself and so we found ourselves all of our energy was helping other people and nothing was focused on ourselves and our own progressions. So in those cases for us it was important to have a smaller group but most of them like 10 to 20 people.

Mike [00:52:21]

And you’re traveling all over the country, so you’re seeing groups that are doing this in their own little style, their own different way and what do you really like and what do you not like of people that are kind of doing this because I think as this becomes a more mainstream conversation whether it’s in today’s society like we were talking about Maps, like there’s a lot of awareness coming and there’s different areas and different pockets of the US that we’re seeing this kind of bubble up to the top and I think what’s the most important thing is, how do we have conversations about this, how do we find the right resources and how do we set the container to be able to allow more and more people to get access to this. So why don’t you talk about like what you’re seeing people all over the country do because I even think in our own backyard here in Utah, there’s a lot of conversations, a lot of people doing this and not only with it. It also affects how often you’re doing that and that type of conversation which is part of this whole picture of how do we create safety for people to have that 4.0 transformation. 

Paul Hutchinson [00:53:21]

If you’re thinking you need to do one of these every two weeks that’s wrong right. There is you don’t get addicted to it but if you’re that’s a crutch at something that you’re not actually doing the work we encourage people we tell people that your body will tell you emotionally when you’re ready for the next one but I will discourage somebody who’s like, hey I want to do one every month. No give yourself about three months follow up with your facilitator ,make sure that you’ve actually done the work and following through with everything that you were trying to create and then and only then would it make sense to do another one but the people that are part of this every month club of going in and hey I’m going to go show up and what’s your intention oh just more love and light. No you didn’t fix whatever you need to fix right and that’s the wrong environment. If people are just continuing every single month more love and light, more love and light. There was an amazing man that had an amazing you know, him and his wife were you know Ken and Barbie type of a thing. Everybody wanted to be them super beautiful couple. They went and did some plant medicine Journeys. She started doing the integration, she started doing her work, she started really coming into her power. He didn’t. He was still screwing around you know, seeing ex-girlfriends and whatever else and he kept going to these freaking Journey experiences every two weeks. He wasn’t doing any of the work. He’s going to lose her. He’s going to lose his relationship. Why not because he wasn’t submitting himself.  He was thinking that the medicine was going to fix him. No it opens the path, his wife was doing the integration work, he wasn’t and so unfortunately just continuing to be the every month club was not going to fix the problem. So I see that as a big problem in a lot of places. Guys this is not something you need to go to every month. This is something you could go to once and fix all of your stuff. You can three months later say, okay now I fixed all the things that I learned. Now I’m going to do another one. Now I have guided and facilitated and been a part of over 57 guided meditation plant medicine Journey experiences right and so I know what works and what doesn’t work. We brought in many different facilitators that were super trained and others that were just you know mess around and be a part of whatever the party was going on and when you take it seriously, when you understand how powerful this tool is as a facilitator and really do the work to do to study and understand how to help people through this. The best facilitator I’ve ever seen is my 26-year-old daughter. I tell people, she’s 12 and 90 she’s 12 years old and her just loving the plants and the bugs and the Flies and stuff right and she’s 90 in her wisdom of being able to really delve in and help people work through their own issues and love them through that experiences and anybody who’s done an experience with her as one of the facilitators, every single person will say absolute hands down best facilitator ever. She’s amazing. 

Mike [00:56:30]

I can attest to that. She is special and I think what you touched on there was the pure beauty of the intention that we go in and then why don’t we also talk a little bit going back to the integration part because that is we just took these 20 people through this life-changing experience and most of them have gone back into their realities as a new way of being and they’re showing up and their spouses are saying, Hey how do I participate? How do I kind of be able to see and take part of this change because it’s a ripple effect and it can happen so quickly and kind of what you were talking about of you don’t need to be doing this so often because when you start changing yourself it’ll start changing others around you and give them hope and inspiration and so what is that kind of look like the path after some of these amazing transformational experiences and how we can help others and how we can communicate about what this experience is to help others out.

Paul Hutchinson [00:57:25]

Yeah. well I love the analogy of compounding interest in personal change right. Literally if you submit yourself to the experience of fixing your stuff right, you go to one of these and you fix and then you take two people and say you know what, my brother needs some help and my wife. I should be perfect or my sister whatever and Mentor them and go help hold space for them in their personal transformation and then they go help hold space and let’s say that takes two months of integration between each one you know or even you know, even a whole year, even if you took a whole year to fix yourself and then two and then two more people the next year that you’re mentoring on their process. Literally if that continues two people helping two people. 33 years, 8 and a half billion people the entire world will have gone through this transformation and if you don’t take a whole year to work through your stuff, if you can get that done in a couple months literally it’s just a handful of years and we’ve created Global change. Now, I’m not saying okay have everybody do a plant medicine experience, kind of am you know I really do. I think that there’s value in us finding ways to really release the things that don’t belong to us and step into that best version of ourselves and honestly this is the best thing that I’ve seen. I ran an anti-anxiety company for a decade. I’ve gone through years of therapy myself. I’ve seen hundreds of people who have dealt with childhood sexual abuse that have come through these and those ones had more of a transformation than everything that I have ever ever seen.

Mike [00:59:05]

And that’s so beautiful because kind of what you’re talking about is also this mindset shift that happens and I’m curious to get your take because you’ve been in very important situations and roles and after you’ve gone through these plant medicine experiences, what to that Do to your mindset and perspective of showing up and how to perform differently because yeah we talked about okay this will help us see and heal some of the pain and trauma but we also didn’t really talk about the impacts that it can have on our society or the people that we work with in changing that lens of mindset because we might be seeing this immediate pain but this long-term kind of compounding return of why we should even be considering it because I think that’s one of the most important things that we can talk about as well.

Paul Hutchinson [00:59:50]

Absolutely we might have to have a second session because we’re about out of time but I’m going to handle that question because this is super cool. So one of the first books that I read that even touched on this was “Tools of Titans” by Tim Ferris and “Tools of Titans”. He went and he interviewed all these different Uber successful billionaires and Titans of Industry to find out what the common threads were with a lot of them. What they did every morning and their process of you know thinking about success and how they LED and other people. One of those common threads that he found was psychedelics and these are Titans. These are guys who ran multi-billion dollar companies you know and created massively successful entrepreneurs they used psychedelics as a way to help them really step into that best version of themselves and release all the craft that really didn’t matter in life and so that was super powerful. That was eye opening for a lot of people. They like, holy crap I never thought about that. He was one of the first that found that was a Common Thread with a lot of them fasinating. So cool stuff. Well, guys I’m going to do a bunch more of these because there’s so much to talk about. We’ll do another one with Mike. We’ll talk with my wife about her experiences as well. Thank you for spending time with us today on the Liberating Humanity podcast. Please share this is one where I really believe that if you shared this with your friends and family and you had somebody who was dealing with anxiety with depression with the heaviness of some childhood trauma, any of those things. If they’ve been going through all kinds of therapy and not getting the help that they need the most compassionate thing that you can do is share this video with them and help them open their eyes to some of the tools that are available now. Don’t do anything illegal guys, unfortunately in a lot of States it’s still illegal. Now we’ve got Colorado. We’ve got Oregon. We’ve got parts of California and others who have decriminalized the use of these tools working on a lot of other states to do so the same or you can come and visit us in South America and in a fully legal environment with train facilitators. You can come and join us down there so come and join us Shameless plug at the very end of this go to Sound Off Freedom book.com and pre-sign up for my book that talks about a lot not only the child rescue stuff but it goes into some of these transformational things that we did as well. So thank you thank you for joining us today.